stumped by premium rejection.

[tomoc]

just got the dreaded "needs modification" notice for my 1st ebook conversion, specifically "Your book's NCX may be incorrectly formatted" I'm surprised because I followed every step in the style guide (almost obsessively.) Here are the details:

>> There were no autovetter error notifications in my smashwords dashboard.

>> I created a linked ToC following the style guide's directions. (I even deleted the gibberish bookmarks etc that were auto-generated. etc)

>> I created the orig. file using the 'nuclear option' - I stripped out ALL formatting and then re-configured everything (with show/hide 'on' of course.)

>> I've rechecked my orig. MSword document. Each link in the ToC goes to the section I want it to, and when you click on every section heading it goes back to the ToC (as expected) The ToC listings are in 'normal' the actual section headings are 'heading 2'

BUT
it does NOT work in the Epub file of my book that I downloaded.
In the epub file only the FIRST item in the ToC goes where it should. The rest go to the end of my book.

BUT
If you click on the section headings they DO go back to the ToC (in the epub file) just as they should.

I also just ran the epub file through 'epub validator' (at: validator.idpf.org/application/validate) and it came back with "no errors"

I am using an oldish version of word, specifically: "Word X for Mac service release 1"

I've been looking over my MSword document and the only plan I can come up with is to just RE-do the whole thing... but I would be re-doing it exactly the same way as before... so I'm guessing I would get the same rejection?

My questions are:
>> Has this happened to other people? (the ToC working in MSword but NOT in epub)?
>> Is there something I missed?
>> Is it a problem with my version of MSword?

Any help or pointers would be greatly appreciated.
thanks.

[Ted]

I've had problems with MSWord, including what you are describing. I've also had problems with the meatgrinder going dumb at times.

First, if you are positive there are no TOC errors, upload the file again and see if it was just a meatgrinder goof. (I've also had goofs at Amazon, which uploading the exact same file corrected problems. Computers. Sheesh.)

Second, if you still have problems then use another word processor to verify no hidden MSWord coding messing with the output.

I'm using Libre Office as it is quite stable. There is a free version for Mac's or PC's. I'd recommend using LO for your documents because it is free, rather than upgrading your MSWord for Mac.

Once your file is opened in libreoffice, check to make sure the links work properly and fix any that don't.

When you're sure everything works fine then do a Save-as and save the file as a MSWord 97-2003 doc. To be on the safe side, export as a PDF too and check to make sure everything works the way they should.

Upload the file to Smashwords as a new version.

[tomoc]

oh... AND I did delete all the 'hidden bookmarks' before submitting too....

[Ted]

Deleted the hidden bookmarks? What hidden bookmarks?

[tomoc]

didn't see (or expect) such a speedy response before I posted my 2nd message. THANKS. I've never heard of libre office - I'm surprised it might work since the style guide discourages using the free 'open office' program. I'll look into it. Here is my plan of attack at the moment:

I've greatly shortened my ToC --- instead of 40 linked sections I've deleted all that and broken it down into just four 'parts' and created a new, much shorter ToC. It isn't quite as convenient, but it might be easier for meatgrinder (and look cleaner on small screens) ... I'm uploading that today. if it gets rejected again - I'll try libre office or some friend's version of MSword.
Thanks-again.
TOC

[Ted]

I publish puzzle books that contain far more than 40 linked sections and have had no problems. I suspect it is MSWord issue or you might have missed something in the formatting of your TOC.

[tomoc]

You're probably right. This time around, instead of just double-checking, I triple-checked and I noticed something odd - even after I deleted the 'hidden bookmarks' that MSword created... if I closed the file and then reopened it: MSword created the same bogus hidden bookmarks AGAIN... especially for my "ackknowledgements" page... so I just deleted that whole link and I'm letting 'acknowledgements' be part of the 'about the author page' ... just uploaded the revised edition and downloaded the new epub file...and this time the ToC works fine.. even though it is much shorter. I'm hoping this'll do the trick. THANKS AGAIN.

[veyles57]

I've received notice after acceptance in Premium catalog. But I don't have an email from smashwords nor any other clue as to why. Is their an issue with the system?

[Ted]

How did you receive notice after acceptance in Premium catalog?

[tangomike]

I just joined this forum because of similar problems with being approved for the Premium Catalog. Here's the short version:

My first book kept getting rejected because of .epub NCX TOC problems. I can't even begin to describe all the headaches. Eventually, I removed the manual bookmarked and hyperlinked TOC because even though the Style Guide suggests that I include one, I discovered that no matter what I did, I couldn't get the file to pass an epubcheck, and as someone suggested here, Word has a very nasty habit of reinserting hidden bookmarks even after you have deleted them all.

The answer for that book turned out to be this: I completely removed the manual bookmark/hyperlink TOC, deleted all the manual page breaks that I'd used to separate chapters, and modified the Heading 1 style to include the option to "insert a page break before" (or something like that). These actions resulted approval for the Premium Catalog.

My second book was rejected for reasons that were my fault, which I have since corrected. I'm waiting to learn whether it will make it into the Premium Catalog.

I just uploaded my third book and am waiting on it as well.

In the meantime, I downloaded the .epub files for both of these new books, which were formatted in Word in exactly the same way.

One book has an extra Chapter One listed at the top of the NCX TOC that takes me to a totally bogus listing of three chapters of an excerpt from a novel that I've included in the book plus an About The Author page at the very end of the book.

The other book has a perfect NCX TOC in terms of appearance and function.

As a test, I saved the original .doc file of the book with the messed-up TOC as HTML and converted it to .epub with Calibre. That .epub opened in Adobe Digital Editions is perfect.

As another test, I downloaded the problem .epub from Smashwords and opened it in Sigil. I realize that members on this forum may not be familiar with Sigil, so I'll just say that I found a file with the bogus NCX TOC entry in that .epub. It was shown as being the fifth file in the document, but it appeared as the bogus Chapter One in the TOC. When I deleted that problem file, the .epub is perfect when opened in Adobe Digital Editions.

I have no answers to offer, unfortunately. In my humble opinion, the Meatgrinder is suspect. I know I can convert a .doc to .epub flawlessly and have the same .doc file end up being rejected from the Premium Catalog due to problems with the .epub. I also know I can download the flawed .epub from Smashwords and fix it in Sigil.

I just sent a message to Smashwords via their comments link to ask for help in solving the problem with the bogus NCX TOC. Other than that, I'm stumped.

[Ted]

tangomike, MSWord may be retaining hidden code despite your changes. Try the nuke method mentioned in the Style Guide and start fresh.

[sharongerlach]

I'm at the end of my patience. I've had a similar issue with my NCX. The thing is, the book was approved for the premium catalog before, and I had to archive it when I enrolled it in Amazon's Kindle Select program. Three months later, took it out of archives, resubmitted for review, and suddenly had problems?? WTH?

Now, two months and seven attempts later, I'm still getting NCX error messages. First, it was there were only four entries in the NCX. Umm, I thought there only had to be two, so why is there a problem? So I did some tinkering, reuploaded and resubmitted. Three weeks later, get same NCX error message. Did some more tinkering, found a couple of tab stops and hidden bookmarks, thought removing those would solve the problem. Reuploaded. Resubmitted. Etc etc etc.

Latest error message is that the last chapter in my NCX leads to the TOC area in EPUB. Umm, yeah, that is because the last link is from the end of the book to the BEGINNING of the book as a courtesy to the reader. It links to exactly where it's supposed to go. Of course, there's no way to tell whomever reviewed it and left the message to make sure I'm understanding their message correctly - wouldn't it be simpler just to say, "Yo, woman, delete the last link, it's messing crap up"?? Then I would know exactly what to do.

This is frustrating. It's 135,000 word book, and I DO NOT want to have to nuke it and add in all the formatting again when the last link goes exactly where it's intended to go - it would be hours of work for no good reason I can see. So what now, OTHER than nuking it?

I should mention I built the TOC manually, using bookmarks and hyperlinks.

[Ted]

You could try coping your book to Libre Office and saving as MSWord doc. 1) Open problematic MSWord doc, 2) choose Select All, 3) Copy, 4) Paste into blank Libre Office document, 5) visually check document for errors or strange formatting and correct, 6) Export as PDF and check hyperlinks and other formatting, 7) if all looks/works fine then, 8) Save As, using the Word 97-2003 selection, naming document different than original, and 9) upload to Smashwords.

If that doesn't work then.....

Sometimes no matter what you try, good old Microsoft Word simply refuses to play nice and you have to nuke.

[tangomike]

The problem with assuming that it's the Word file and suggesting a nuke solution is this:

If the exact same .doc file uploaded to Smashwords converts to epub through Calibre and Sigil with no NCX TOC problems, and that .epub renders flawlessly on my computer with Adobe Digital Editions, Nook for Mac, and on both a Nook and an iPad, how in the world can it be a problem with the .doc file? The problem, in my humble opinion, is with the Meatgrinder to Word interface.

I downloaded the problem .epub from Smashwords and opened it in Sigil. If you're not familiar with the Sigil workspace, the center section shows the book in normal text. On the left is a listing of the individual files (chapters, split apart by the page breaks), and on the right is a listing of all the chapter headings just like a TOC. Selecting a listed file/chapter on either the left or the right side takes you to that chapter in the book.

In the TOC listing on the right side I found the offending extra Chapter One sitting at the top of the TOC above the good Chapter One. Selecting it took me to a partial TOC listing, not a chapter, showing Chapter One,Two, and Three of the excerpt that's at the END of the book, and below that the About The Author page at the end of the excerpt.

When I clicked through the files listed on the left side (again, these are the same chapters corresponding to the ones shown on the right side), the FIFTH one from the top brings up the bogus Chapter One, Two, Three and About The Author page. That file sits between the end of the TOC (that I manually typed into the front matter simply to show the chapter organization, and which has no linking or bookmark function) and the real Chapter One.

This makes absolutely no sense, and I have no way to troubleshoot a problem with the Meatgrinder, where I think the problem lies.

I'm simply not willing to strip the formatting out and have to manually add it all back into a .doc file that is perfect except when the Meatgrinder gets hold of it. I'm about to conclude that using Smashwords isn't worth the trouble.

[Ted]

I had the exact same problem in 2010, and went through the same steps you mention using sigil and calibre. I finally pasted the problematic book to OpenOffice, checked the bookmarks and found a couple were messed up, corrected them, saved as MSWord 2003 doc, and had success uploading to Smashwords.

Maybe I was lucky.

I understand the Meatgrinder and Calibre are very similar converters, if not the same. Check the source code for your epub from Smashwords and you'll see 'Calibre' mentioned many times.

As the Meatgrinder and Calibre are quite similar you could send Smashwords Support your research and ask them to look into the problem.